Couldn't have said it any better......

[spyglass]

I have been following the "Occupy" protests on the news, the internet, etc. A friend sent the following link to me and it sums things up perfectly. I could not have said it any better.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAOrT0OcHh0" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAOrT0OcHh0</a>


Spyglass

[Ron Kruger]

None of what he says applies to me, Spy. I'm 63, never even collected unemployment, live partially on the game and fish I gather and gut myself and never in my life have I seen such a corrupt economic disparity and political system. This isn't the America I grew up in, and while some of these protesters may be the spoiled generation he talks of, this just looks like propaganda for the super rich. The "American Dream" is turning into the American Scream. Hell, they're even calling the Social Security I paid into since my first real job at 13-years old as an "entitlement."
Free market societies expand and grow based upon greed, and they collapse based upon greed.
I think these protests are overdue, and I'd be right there with them, but I need to put a deer or two in the freezer first.

[blackcloudbrew]

Interesting response Ron, I don't - yet - feel fully invested in the occupy movement but it is quite interesting how those that don't understand what it's about want to demonize in some way those people out there on the streets. This video is one of the softer forms of all of this but it's right in there with a lot of other less kind words from the American right wing. Just as a couple of years ago when the so called Tea Party movement arose here, lots of pundits wanted to instantly categorize those folks and in many respects tried and did quite successfully to corrupt or redirect that movement to their wishes. The occupy movement is in a similar situation now. I have no idea where it's going or what change it will achieve, because it will achieve something, and already has at least one thing, redirecting the discussion in the United States to what the real issues are in our screwed up economy etc. I'm with Ron, these protests are long overdue - here. Be careful about characterizing the people participating in them because one of them, one day, may be me (with a few cameras...).

To me, as a child of the 1960's, this is a very welcome and healthy development. Power to the people!

[Ron Kruger]

Tim and I just organized occupy PentaxWorld. Anyone who wants to join gets a flower and some beads.

[blackcloudbrew]

Ah...dude...like we are already here. They'll have to drag us away. The only way you'll get my cameras, lenses, tripods, filters, camera bags, bottles of developer chemicals, rolls of film, light meters, teleconverters, photo lights, strobes, photo albums, etc. is from my cold dead hands...

[spyglass]

You do have to wonder what good this actual "occupy" movement will bring about. When interviewed many of the participants do not have any focus, direction, or common answer. Some appear to be anti corporation, some anti capitalism, some anti establishment, some just plain anti everything. In reality they will enjoy a short lived camp out in the street / park, leave a mess behind, and go back to supporting the corporations they have and will always support. The marches and call for social change that Earl and T-man recall are in the past. Today's young generation is lazy, unrealistic, materialistic, and directionless. I blame the educational system for being out of touch with the real world, for promoting non competition. But at the end of the day young people can be comforted that it is not their fault. Someone else is to blame (perhaps a corporation or someone that is doing better).

I feel like a just stoked the fire and tossed a couple of logs on. Now just let me fasten my seat belt for the replays    (and the sign says long hard hippy people, need not apply) 


Spyglass

[Ron Kruger]

I think you have the wrong idea of the demographics of the protesters, Spy. They are of all ages, backgrounds and education levels. They are protesting out of a feeling of hopelessness with the broken and corrupt system. They are all victims of it, as am I, and have come to the sad realization that justice, fairness, honesty and rights, including that of casting their votes, mean nothing. We have been prayed upon, especially by financial institutions. They realize the root of the problem lies with big money, so they set up camp on Wall Street, but the realy problem is the way this money has bought the entire government that talks about "what the people want," when everything is scewed toward what the richest 1 percent want. They realize we go to war mostly to fatten up the military industrial complex. They realize that the entire system smells of a scam, and they are powerless to do anything about it, except set up a tent and protest. The same thing was done during the "Great Depression," with camps called "Hooverville."

[blackcloudbrew]

Sypglass, if a San Francisco liberal from the Left Coast and an Ozark Hillbilly can agree on something (non-camera or fishing related of course), ya gotta wonder what's going on.

[Ron Kruger]

Yes, we definitely wear different hats, but they're both cocked the same way on this issue.

[JIMBO]

Time each of us grew up and faced reality. There is no such thing as a free ride and there never was. The ride over the past, for many, was built on credit and doing so showed no value in what was purchased. Not their money. Same thing with the politics.. very easy to spend.. or borrow on someone eleses dime. Creed got us here and the fall will effect us all, unless.. we finally grow up and get rid of the what we call entitlements. Left needs to move to the center as does the right. When was the last time you said life is just fine and I can live without what I can't afford. Spy, interesting video and lets hope its not too late! Cheers JIM

[spyglass]

I think the initial "ground" movement had credibility, and was made up of a reasonable representation of people as you suggest. But like most protests the problem comes with the "trouble making opportunist element". They join in whenever there is a stage to promote mayhem. The Vancouver situation is probably the best example of a protest that has lost direction and is geared to go off the rails. In Calagary , Alberta the protest is divided into to separate distinctive groups at two separate locations (students and the Haves in one / homeless people and Have Nots in the other). A proposal was being put together to provide a housing opportunity for many in the homeless side. The other side selfishly saw this as  ploy to weaken the Occupation and tried to interfere and speak on the behalf of the whole Occupation. What bothered me most was that, generally speaking, the Students and the Haves can go home any time they want while the homeless are facing a Canadian winter and more dire situation .

The system may be corrupt, may be downright unfair, but unless people are prepared to bring the great Western wheel to a grinding,  crashing,  halt, and live with the cost that comes along with it, change will not happen.  Change does not happen by tapping on the shoulder of the problem and saying "excuse me". It comes when the force of encouragement to change is greater than the force to resist is reached. The people with nothing to lose will fight the battle for the middle class, who do still have something to lose, and be marginalized and written off as hoodlum and undesirable. The system has the deck stacked in their favour (media, courts, law enforcement, military, etc).  The camps will quickly erode and degrade and leave a unfavourable impression of what was a romantic notion at best.


Spyglass

P.S. I would love to wear the hat, cock it just right...... but the Corporations have switched the manufacturing lines from hats to snow shovels.

[blackcloudbrew]

Interesting perspectives guys. I'd like to revisit this discussion in say March next year. It will be interesting to see where this movement goes and what changes happen because of it. I have no predictions, but I do know that change is hard.